Every once in awhile I like to shake things up here on Luvin' My Curves... don't get me wrong I love to talk about fashion, but I absolutely love when there's someone out there who wants to submit what's on their mind....
Today's submission comes from Neil; he's a single, successful (and cute) friend of mine who moved to NYC a couple of years ago. He's always joked about writing a blog from a man's point of view about both his appreciation & frustration with plus size women. I made him put his money where his mouth was when I told him to speak his mind here...read on.
From a man's eyes:
When you think that no man is watching, hold your head high because men love meat, and we especially love women with meat on their bones! I love the way your hips and thighs support your frame, the way you do your hair, the way you strut in your heels. One of my favorite things is to see a well dressed woman who you just KNOW holds her head high- who isn't the least bit ashamed to wear a mini skirt or a suit that complements the curves on her body.
"Where are the men who love plus size women here in NYC?"
I've heard this so many times since I moved to NYC I can't even count, and for a long time I couldn't understand why you ladies would say that. But after seeing the social scene here in NY I understand why ladies here feel the way that they do. No disrespect to the guys, but really, where are you? Actually, I take that back- because the less love you show the better for me, if I were that kind of guy.
There is nothing like a plus size women, an intelligent beautiful women who's over a size 14. It's not a fetish or fantasy- I just want a woman who fills out a dress, who enjoys life and revels in her beauty.
I went through my skinny phase, mainly when I was way more concerned about what others thought of the choices I made. I would be friends with the plus size ladies on my campus always beating myself up because I was too much of a punk to be upfront about the fact that I liked them in a different way. When I graduated college and went back home to the South, I went back to my preferences... and never looked back. However since moving up here, I see that many fellas don't even bring their eyes up to look at that fine, well-dressed size 18 vision that walks into the lounge- but instead fall over themselves at her thinner and sometimes not so well-dressed counterpart . I don't get it... and when I asked some of them about it they really couldn't give me an answer- I guess it's just the way it's always been with them, skinny girls only.
Perhaps it's a geographic thing, or a numbers game. As a man who's eyes gravitates to the woman of a more plush variety it's been hard for me to meet an educated, beautiful and confident plus size woman. So just like some of you are looking for me, I'm also looking for you. I go to alot of professional functions and happy hours in the hopes that a plus size queen would walk in and we'd hit it off, but all I see are thin women.The rare occasions I do see a plus size woman it's obvious that she's not happy as is, she's covering everything up, and when asked to dance looks at me like I'm playing a game. (I'm not, I really want to dance with you!) I've been to the BBW parties here but the vibe I get is more of a sexual nature - which is not what I'm seeking.
See what I want.. is a CONFIDENT woman, a woman who loves herself & isn't looking for me to love her so that only then she can begin to love herself as well- this is where we run into problems. I've gotten accused of cheating only because my ex was insecure about her weight and couldn't understand why I wanted to be with her, she saw herself as fat when I saw her as beautiful.
When I met LMC I couldn't help but to ask my boy about her, her smile, her dress her confidence... stunning. My friend replied "She's on point... and would be the perfect girl if she lost 50 lbs". Usually I would have been stunned by his remark, but unfortunately I see that alot of guys say things similar in effect- conditional external factors that stop them from dating outside of their comfort zone.
I'll stop speaking about the attitudes of my fellow man but step out to speak about you ladies. When I say you're beautiful I mean it- there's no game, no pretense just a man that sees a beautiful woman. I think some women of size have unfortunately gotten used to being in the background that they don't know how to react when asked to step centerstage. I only wish that some of you would truly believe in your beauty because it's no fun having to constantly tell it to you because you can't believe it yourself. In my eyes you're just right... but you have to believe it as well.
Maybe I'm asking for too much, for a woman who loves herself, dresses well and instead of pushing me away because I love her thighs- pulls me closer. One who doesn't get antsy when a group of thinner women walk by, but instead can smile and hold her head high. A woman who isn't afraid to dance in a packed room or maybe just for me.....a woman who works out for health reasons instead of trying to fit into the "ideal". I want a woman who loves "her" and have it show!
I understand that these attitudes come from things I may not be able to comprehend- some are deeply rooted and no amount of affection could begin to solve. But if you're not willing to let go of those feelings enough to let someone else in- then you'll only attract guys who don't have the right intentions.
I guess what I'm saying is this" If you're looking for me, I'm right here.. where are you?"
Can we discuss this?
Ladies, am I totally off track with my mindset? Enlighten me, please.
Fellas, do you find yourself overlooking a plus woman or if you prefer dating plus size women has it been hard to find one who's confident in her own skin. I want to know what you think.
~Neil
19 comments:
Neil brings up some good points in his letter. He's looking for us and we're looking for him. As he pointed out there are many reasons that curvy women may appear to be a bit stand offish in a social setting. You do become use to being the bag lady for your smaller friends as men approach them to dance and you stand there only visible because you're standing in the corner holding 3 or 4 handbags. Of even when you are younger and you know guys approach you jokingly to say that their friend likes you and then they all begin to laugh. Unfortunately we carry those things with us into adulthood and are hard to shake. The perpetual (big) butt of everyone's fat girl joke. So Neil please don't give up, I'm looking for you too!
Kudos to Neil!
I love a thick woman but like Neil, I've found it almost impossible to find a confident, professional plus size woman here in the city. I know they exist, but I swear that they don't go out afterwork or don't attend networking socials. In those rare instances I spend most of my time trying to convince her that my attraction is genuine, that gets tired really quickly. Neil, when you find one ask her if she has a friend me, man.
Great post.
P.S: Maybe I shouldn't put you on blast but if you liked LMC when you saw her why didn't you holla?
Good post. I'll preface with stating I'm originally from the NY area.
I do agree with Neil in regards to his comments about the attractiveness of a confident women. Whether plus sized or not, a confident woman is the highest turn-on for me. In my experience, I've noticed that friends and colleagues tend to shy away from approaching a plus size woman because it's often ridiculed by others. I think it is a cop out because behind closed doors they show plus sized ladies love. That right there screws with a plus-sized woman's mind even more, damaging their confidence.
Before I found my beautiful wife, (yes, she's a plus size woman) I dated women of ALL sizes as long as they had a high confidence level. Lucky for me I found a women with high-self esteem, looks, intelligence, AND curves to kill.
At the end of the day it's about self-love. Until plus-size women embrace all of the beauty they hold and us men stop fronting about what we want, this will be an issue. Like the beautiful, sexy Jill Scott says: Love yourself, and then we can really start loving each other.
Keep your head up brother, you'll find your queen.
Great post Neil. As a woman that's currently on a weight-loss journey for health reasons, it can be hard to feel pretty in this city when it seems that everyone is looking for that rail-thin model chick. And even as I get closer to my weight goal, I know I'll never be that girl nor am I trying to be -- a size 14-16 is fine by me. It's nice to know that guys like you actually do exist because too often I see guys dating the wrong girl just because she looks a certain way then have the nerve to complain when it doesn't work out. I think we all need to get over ourselves.
He talked about the BBW party scene in NYC and his analysis was on point. That is just a "hook-up" crowd. I've gone to those parties and you meet guys and eventually find out that they have slept with a majority of the women that attend. So my question to men like Neil and Kenneth, where can I find you in the city and more like you for my girls....we're all 14+ and all single...We are young black professionals looking for the same
Great article!
I live in the Metro Atlanta area and there are a few groups here that have BBW parties and I have attended but they really aren't for me. I agree with the previous comment about the parties seeming like a "hook-up" gathering. Not all plus size woman is looking to "hook-up" with every man that steps to her. Trust, we are not desperate.
I love Neil's piece. You can feel his adoration, attraction, and passion for "women of size" without a doubt. However, one noticeable thing has happened in the plus size community and is evident even in Neil's piece. In some of the comments that follow as well. Within the plus size community, amidst all the "I like big girls, plus size,meat on the bones women" wave of public admission, has come segregation.
Men are saying they like big girls but, they only like certain "types" of big girls. I am not speaking of characteristics like confidence, style, and decorum. I am speaking of a plus sized girl and her physical build. It is no longer just an "I like big girls thing". Rather, it is now an "I ONLY like big girls who; have a small waist, big breasts,and a 56' behind" thing!
As I noticed, the "beautiful vision" in Neil's piece was a size 18! Definitely on the lower end of the plus size scale and most definitely NOT a big girl at all depending on her height. In the comments(sorry for the possible blast), commenter Kenny says he finds it almost impossible to find a confident, professional plus size woman in his city. I find that extremely hard to believe! UNLESS however, he is looking for this new found standard for acceptable women of size. The "porn bodied" BBW is what I like to call them. They are the large breasted, small waist, 56' behind girls that you see all over the net and in porn today. Think Crystal Clear the porn star or Mercedes BBW (or any of her girls), and you know what I am referring to. If this is who Kenny is seeking then, her elusiveness is not unbelievable to me because, there are few of us with the genes to be big and have it in "all the right places". Without a little hard work and modification that is.
I don't know if it is the surge of BBWs in the adult industry, the increase in BBWs on networking sites that portray a certain "look" or, is it simply men still viewing their preferences of a plus sized woman as a NO-NO and wanting her to fit into whatever acceptable realm of big girls that the majority sets as standard. For example, the buddy that will accept your fat girlfriend more and give you praise if she is shaped like Crystal Clear as oppose to Kelly Price before the surgery.
This touches a certain place with me because as a younger woman, I can remember NOT being the sought after girl simply because I was a "big girl". Then, my prayers were answered and men became more aware that beauty trancended weight classes and categories. They even became brazen in publicly admitting and flaunting their attraction to big girls like me! Now, yet again, I am back in this place of insularity in my healthy,well groomed,shapely, confident 5' 10, size 28(YES twenty-eight)frame. Why? Because men are stating big girls as a preference but; that preference now comes with weight limits, inch requirements, and size restrictions!
Syn just opened up another can of worms on this issues. I frequent the BBW party scene in NYC and the first time I went I had a guy say to me....you know you too small to be here.....so it left me with the feeling of damn too big for one club and too small for another....WTF!!!!! anyway as Syn pointed out there is much debate within the plus size community as far as women are concern with what is big vs small like ladies that are a 14 yes are big by "mainstream" stream industry standards but when compared to a woman that is a size 20 plus there is a noticeable difference....its that often discussed debate of fat vs thick. This post has sparked up an interesting debate. I'm interested to hear more!!!!!
Great post!
First off let me say that I'm excited by these comments so thank you for commenting.
@Anonymous #1: I won't give up, never that.
@Kenny: Glad to know we on the same page buddy. In re: LMC I didn't holla because she was so busy with school. (poor excuse I know, but since she's Ms. Esq now it's a different ball game)
@Louis: Thanks for the support man!
@Miss Smith: :) I'm glad you liked it! I love it when a woman knows that healthy does not equal thin.
@Anonymous #2 & 3: The BBW parties don't work for me, but I dont know of another place where I can meet women in a non hook up capacity.
@Synfully Delishus: I just said size 18, but my vision is beyond that too.
@Anonymous #4: Yes, this is an interesting debate!
@Stephanie: Thanks!
I found LMC's blog via Twitter so hey girl!!
In response to Neil's post I found it very insightful. It's good to know that there are men who don't mind dating plus size women.
In response to Syn's comment, I would agree that there is a 'class system' amongst plus size women with men. I am size 18 and very curvy with a smaller (but not flat!) waist. I guess I do fit what would be more of an hour glass type shape. But that doesn't mean that I still don't get told that I'm really pretty but I'm just "too big" or I don't get approached by men who would love to sleep with me and do nothing else.
I can't help how I'm shaped. That doesn't mean I don't get discriminated against when it comes to dating. To me, plus size is plus size. Should I get up to a size 26 so I can be recognized as 'real'?? I think there is no need to be divisive.
And as for a plus size party scene I live in Houston and I wouldn't even know where to begin to find it. I would relish the chance to meet single, eligible men who aren't ashamed to date (and not just screw) plus sized women.
But from what I seem to be reading here, seems I'm not missing much.
Hey! I loved this post! It was great!!
It's refreshing to hear from a guy like Neil!
Especially when there are other men that blog about how the only way a woman can get a man is to be skinny or lose weight!
I'm not PROMOTING the blog below, I am just sharing it because he has the opposite viewpoint, and this may help men like Neil understand why some "big girls" may be hard to approach. Men like the guy that wrote the blog below are making it hard for all of us!
I love you all! And I am proud to be the woman that I am!!!
Thanks for helping me Love My Curves!!!!
http://bornunknown.blogspot.com/2009/06/help-for-women-over-30.html
Hmm...I haven't been the fat, dateless friend since high school. And part of the reason I was had a lot to do with Neil's keyword "confidence". I really had a issue with my weight as a teen but long ago I decided to stop living my life around my weight. (See my post here: http://blog.collectiveelements.com/2009/06/own-it-love-it.html)
I've dated guys who preferred alittle meat but to be honest most of the guys I dated weren't necessarily into big girls...they were into me. And I believe that had alot to do with the fact that I liked me and showed that in the way I carried myself. I'm not talking about conceit. I'm talking about just being happy with yourself. I love to laugh and flirt. I love to CONVERSE and I love to banter. Most of the men I dated were attracted to those qualites and the fact that I'm a plus size beauty just enhances the package, lol. And if they didn't like my attributes, I stopped taking it personal and accepted that there are other fish in the sea who will.
If any problems I had with dating, it had to be time and interests. I am quite busy between being a mom to my 7 yr old daughter, working full-time, part-time business, part-time grad school, etc...dating has always been hectic. I don't drink so the club scene holds no interest and bbw parties always seemed to wild for me. I did meet my current beau online two years ago and though I don't quite meet his height requirements, he thinks I'm a keeper, lol.
OMG!!! I love this post! This is so great! I am so happy to hear from a guys perspective on dating plus size ladies. I live in Nashville and I find it totally difficult to date guys. They often get very shy/scared when it comes to choosing to date a plus size girl. I even had one guy say "I rather have an ugly face and slim body over a plus girl."
Well needless to say, it is a blow to one's psyche - but when we keep remembering that GOD made us ALL beautiful, we can start letting our gaurds down.
And, yes, I have been the the best freind to the they guy too ashamed to admit he wants to date me. It SUCKS! He'd rather have me at arms length than as his girl. But we plus ladies have to keep moving forward.
Once again, thanks for the encouraging words and I will continue to keep my head up and in search for guys like you who are mature enough to like all women.
Synfully Delishus I also share your views. I am a plus size woman who wears a size 26/28 (all plus size clothes are not made the same which is another topic.)In certain stores anything over say a size 24 is called SUPER PLUS (don't even get me started!) I carry myself well, I work and go to church, I go to college part-time, I am very confident yet trying to meet someone who is looking for a plus size woman is difficult. Thank you Neil for you comments. It's good to know there are men out there but as Syn said: even they want a big girl to be not so big! I have some sucess in dating before so I know it is possible. To All plus size: You GO GIRL! Keep doing your thang and making it happen.
Okay LMC
I read your blog but never comment. I enjoyed reading Neil's point of view but I guess I have a different point of view because I live outside of Dallas. I was born and raised in New Orleans (even went to college there) and never had a problem dating but when I first got here I was so sure that there would not be an avenue for plus size women to find decent men.
Funny how I always thought that the girls in NYC had it better because I have met a few guys from there that have moved here and love the plus size women.
I don't do the groups or their parties I just do what I like and if I see someone I want I let it be known, if he is interested then he will respond accordingly if not I keep it moving.
Lots of love
From Texas
I love this post, especially Syn's note...
Being from the south, there is a lot of so-called big girl love. Guys say that they like plus size girls but it's only those as Syn mentioned - DD, 26 inch waist, 56 inch hips. Is that realistic? I don't think so. This type of woman is glorified by popular culture, so the impressionable fall for it and assume it reality.
I am not plus sized by most definitions. I'm a size 12 and, although hourglass shaped, do not fit into that Crystal Clear category. Because I do not, people feel the need to tell me that my butt is not big enough or that my this is too big or my that is too small.
Why are our bodies the concern of anyone us besides us? I am of the opinion that 1)we tend to lack confidence for the reasons mentioned by other posters, 2)popular culture dictates what a woman should be, whether it right or wrong, and the impressionable believe it, and 3)because of 1 &2, we fall into believing 1 & 2, and therefore affected by what they think.
I am afraid I am one of those people who is affected by the unrealistic expectations of a woman's body. My sister is 5'2'' and a size zero(and all of my dates expressed interest in her!). I've always been in the shadows due to lack of confidence and fear of being judged. Teaching myself that it's no one's concern is hard, especially when people continue to make comments on it.
if you don't mind me asking...how old are you?
LMC here! For anonymous.. I'm 26 and Neil is 28.
Wow, I'm glad I made Neil finally "get to getting" and write this post.
Speaking for me and my other curvy girl sisterfriends, the NYC girls do not have it easy here. Now granted there are some guys who genuinely like plus size women, but I havn't had much luck. I'm told that when you add the Esq. to the mix then the intimidation sets in, but I hope that's not the case. Maybe I'll start to do a mini-series on the blog about dating because it seems no matter where we're from the issues are similar.
Soooo glad you liked this post, I'll get Neil and maybe some others guys as well to keep posting. ;)(Ahem!)
~LMC
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